The 30' Breakaway I just bought has a very bad leak at the steering box, leaves quite a puddle after just a few hours. Sparton chassis, the box mounts to the front axle.

Is this a known problem for this model? If anyone has had this issue, what was the fix? New box or seal kit?

Love this barth!! Can't stay out of it!

Ed

I can't speak to that problem directly, but my experience with other steering boxes is that it's not worthwhile attempting to replace the seals.

You'll need to inspect the unit to be sure the leak is from the seals and not the hoses or fittings; in my experience, probably 3/4 of the leaks are hoses and 1/4 seals. Seals tend to be pretty robust. (I'd replace both hoses if the box is replaced/repaired anyway)

Most of the work comes from removal and replacement, and although it's usual to assume the seals have failed due to age, they could also have been stressed by bad bearings (however,that's quite rare in power steering units, but one doesn't know what the prior owner might have neglected - that said, if the unit ran low on fluid, it's usually the pump that dies).

Once the old box is out, I'd suggest swapping for a new/rebuilt one...or at least having the old one professionally rebuilt unless you have a reliable way to check runout on the output shaft under load.

Thanks Rusty. It is definitely the seal on the output shaft that is leaking, hoses are OK as well as the conncetions of the hoses to the box. I am leaning toward replacing the box as well because it will be tighter and have better steering response and less slop.

Ed

If there is slop in the steering box, then is a definite candidate for replacement. They tend not to get better

I hope yours is easier to get to than the one on my '87 Ford van or my SOB...

Oops - I didn't see that yours is Bill Bumstead's old coach, and that you're mechanically inclined - please don't think I was "talking down" to you...Being a former marine engineer, I also do most of my own work.

I used to work on M-Bs - back in the days when with a pocketful of sockets and combo wrenches you could strip one down to its underwear; all I needed to know was it an "odd" size (11mm, 13mm, 15mm, etc.) or an "even" (10, 12, 14....)

[This message has been edited by Rusty (edited January 23, 2006).]

No worry Rusty, I appreciate any info. Box on the Sparton chassis is very easy to get to, just resting on the front axle, big and heavy thou!

Have talked to a re-builder and they can do it in a day or so, pricey but it is a full re-build. I will replace all ball joints at the same time and re-align, has a bit of a wander and I suspect toe is out.

Just going thru a complete cleaning Engine room today, and trying to understand everything that is there and how it all works together. Barth is very well thought out and has many advanced features!!

Ed

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Ed
94 Breakaway

MWrench...

I seem to have the same problem on my 1990 Regency ...appears that the steering box is in the same location on my Spartan Chassis.

Just curious if you could e-mail me off-list regarding details of your repair?

Mine drips and the steering seems to have less than "good feel" ...can't really describe-it as "play" at this point, but could be smoother.

E-mail addy: rmortis7@earthlink.net

Drop-me-a-line if that works for you.

Thanks!

Robin McCullough


...anyone else: in the process of having a steering geer-box rebuilt, can one also replace the steering column or change the angle of the steering column from it's original position?

I'm also "missing" the "boot" that covers the opening in the firewall / floor, as the steering column passes-thru the "floor" to the steering box ...where do I get a replacement "boot" for a 1990 Regency?

rM

RM:

Sure, I will be glad to post or email you regarding the "fix". I am also looking at changing the angle of the wheel as it is not quite right for me and my prefered driving position. (it is OK but certainly not optimal!)



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Ed
94 Breakaway

How did the steering box rebuild go???

Were you able to do anything with the steering angle???

Do you now have better "feel" and smoother steering???

I had the box re-built by a local shop that specializes in steering box repair. (Straightline Steering in San Jose, CA.) Box doesn't leak at all and the cost wasn't too bad all things considered, $400 out the door, I removed and replaced the unit.

I am still not happy with the steering feel, I checked the toe and caster, spot on, King pins good, ball joints have no play, I have just replaced all shocks with Bilsteins and it is better but still not quite what I want. I did replaced the tires on the front with Bridgestones (225R70 19.5)about the same time as the box repair. I think I should have stuck with Michelins with the 225 size. I am beginning think the feel issue is tire related.

I am going to stay with the 8R19.5 on the rear because I don't want to increase engine speed 50 RPM at cruise.

I played around with tire pressure (8.00Rx 19.5) and discovered that, althoough I like to keep the pressure pumped up, that lowering the pressure front and rear to near that recommended for the loads, improved handling.

On my P30 based Barth the steering was terrifying. I also have a steering box that leaks and shopping on the net it appears the going rate is something in the 350.00 range.

Thus far all I have done is shocks.

The shocks are not Bilsteins, they are 4 way suspension by Trail Master and at least based on 300 miles of driving I must say I am very pleased. While chatting with the tech guy at Trail Master, he spent quite some time with me, he offered two observations I did not know about.

First he suggested that something he called “rubber walled” Michelins were the best tire, he also suggested another I do not recall but said that belted tires do make the P30 wander. For what it is worth those are his thoughts.

The second observation had to do with warranty replacements on his shocks. It appears that more than one person pumped up their air bags and tore the shocks apart he suggested a chain or some strap thing that he said is available from off-road sellers that limits how far the shocks can be drive up.


I do find that it takes about fourty miles for my tires to heat up and the Barth to track well.

I plan to call Energy Suspension tomorrow and see if they have polyurethane kits for the P30,Engine and Transmission mounts as well if I can get them.

Then the springs and last the steering box. At 350.00 to 400.00 I want to make sure the other things are in order first.

Timothy

quote:

First he suggested that something he called “rubber walled” Michelins were the best tire, he also suggested another I do not recall but said that belted tires do make the P30 wander. For what it is worth those are his thoughts.

Timothy

With all due respect, your shock guy gave you strange advice. Without boring you more than I will, tire construction falls into three basic categories: Cross-bias, cross-bias belted, and radial. The latter two are belted tires, and I suspect you'd have a tough time finding cross-bias tires anywhere on the market today.

"Rubber-walled" Michelins? What is his take on the construction of all tires - "chopped liver"?

Some people with RVs like Michelins, but of those I've talked to, more dislike them. Now, of those disliking them, several found their RVs were Factory Overweight, and thus the tires not up to the task, but I as a Michelin buyer for years (1966 though 1986), due to chronic problems with them on two cars (7 failures on one car, 4 on the other), I no longer am a fan. My Ford E350 van, Lexus LS400, and Barth have Bridgestones. I did run into a problem with a set of Bridgestones on the van (2 instances of belt separation) including $1,200 in damage to the rear quarter panel in one instance, but Bridgestone paid without complaint, and gave me a new set of tires (the prior ones had about 30K miles on them) at no charge.

Anyway, tires should need no warmup...there's another issue if it takes 40 miles for your Barth to start behaving and tracking well. I'm not capable of figuring out why you have that issue; maybe one of the more knowledgeable Barthers would offer suggestions. All I know is that it ain't normal.

Rusty:

Yep I was not too sure I followed what he had to say about tires as well. Myabe I did not listen too carefully.

And as I think about it 40 miles for the tires to warm up is an overstatement no matter how you cut it.


The shocks are nice none the less. I hope they last well.

Timothy

Frankly, I don't think any grownup could have followed the logic - since there is none. I'd have to say it was gibberish, presented by a shock guy, not a tire guy. I'm fortunate in that one of my best friends owned a chain of tire stores, and he does know tires (as well as customer service - and I've insured all his operations for years).

Anyhoo, good shocks are betterthan cheap shocks, and it sounds like you've been given sound advice on those, at least.

But the issue of it taking 40 mles for the handling to settle down I still find puzzling...all I can think of offhand is that the tires are underinflated, and it takes that long for the temp/pressure to build up, but it sounds like you're not likely to allow that.

When I get a chance to see Pete again, I'll ask him. No one knows tires and handling better than he.

On my previous P30 chassis SOB, I put Henderson bellcrank bearings on both sides and had an alignment. That really settled things down. If I had kept it I would have put a lateral bar on the rear to keep the rear axle from swinging, I had to put new rear springs in and that helped because there were new eyelets which kept he springs from moving side to side with load shift.