quote:

Originally posted by olroy:
Those numbers are gross vehicle weight ratings (gwvr), not scale weights. My '90 Regal has a gvwr of 5000 lbs. front, & 10,000 lbs. rear, plus the tag axle which adds 5200 lbs. to the rear gvwr. With a normal load, & two people in the front seats, it scales at 5760 lbs. front, & 11,640 rear, for a total scale weight of 17,400 lbs.

In terms of gvwr, it's overloaded on the front, with excess capacity in the rear. Most Barths on P-30 chassis are likely to be similar. I don't know how the Ford chassis' compare, but every Barth owner (every motorhome owner for that matter) should have his rig weighed.

Motorhome chassis overloading has been a complaint against the RV industry since day one, and more of a problem with gassers than diesels. I'd wager that some of the diesel behemoths built today will also be technically overloaded.

My largest concern in my relatively small degree of overloading is to be sure the tires are adequate for the load, and properly inflated, and that ride heights are within specs..

Before anyone panics at this level of technical overloading, they should remember there is a built-in safety factor in terms of component strength which, in part, covers the manufacturer's posterior from product liability lawsuits. Furthermore, the addition of aftermarket airbags, auxiliary springs, steering improvements, etc., improve safety, handling, and weight-carrying capacity.

To add insult to injury, the gross combined weight rating (gcwr - motorhome plus the toad) for an RV with a 454 and a 4.10 rear axle, is 16,000 lbs.. I'm 1400 lbs over that already before I add a 2850 lb. Suzuki .

Am I suicidal? No. Just a typical RVer with a heavy-for-its-size gasser, dealing with the problem that created the big demand for aftermarket chassis improvements in the first place.

These are the facts of life, friends. Go get your rig weighed as you normally load it. If you are within the weight ratings shown on your manufacturer's build-plate, you're lucky indeed. Folks with diesel pushers are likely to be more fortunate in this respect, most of their chassis are designed for heavier duty.

The major effect for gasser owners, once the chassis has been maxed out with the desirable options, is all the mechanical components are going to wear out faster than they would if loaded within limits. The fact that many of our rigs are doing fine after 20 years, or more, suggests that isn't a significant problem in normal RV use. Indeed, that's why manufacturers have long been doing it on the cheap.

Go get your rigs weighed, and check it out.

quote:

Originally posted by Bill:
---All statements above are right on the money---

I have heard this same complaint from MANY owner operators and company owners about getting tickets for driving down the road overloaded. It doesn't work with the DOT inspectors for them.

The DOT will only cite a RV that is overloaded [b]after an accident and then will write a report about the dangers of overloading. The reason I was told is that an RV is NOT A COMMERCIAL VEHICLE and thus does not fall under DOT mandates for vehicle safety inspections or weighing on the road.

So then I asked about the commercial rental firms for RV. Shouldn't DOT inspect those? The answer is "an RV is considered a consumer, non commercial product and it is up to the hiway safety administration to issue citations for vehicle overloading."

The answer is... everyone knows it's being done but no one wants to rope these companies in for selling a "stressed product".

Thank God for the aftermarket, without those products there would be more a lot more accidents.

Any vehicle that is sold should be (IMHO) sold to the end user with 10-15% to spare. Sounds simple enough right? The RV industry (as a rule) buys a chassis that's rated for 18k and then builds the rig to weigh 17,900 is criminal IMHO.

This of course barely scratches the surface... That same overloaded rig if it was a commercial vehicle would require a special license and training. Not so for the RV industry. You have an overloaded chassis being driven down the road by some people who can't even drive a car!

I know there were some ruffled feathers for that statement... but, why is it OK to force a special license for someone driving airbrakes on a straight job truck and not OK for the same chassis wrapped in a motorhome pulling the same weight not to require it. Most RV's that I see that fall into this category are longer and sometimes wider then the same type of truck.

The insurance industry recognizes this FACT (not an opinion) and will give drivers a lower rate if you have a commercial license or have taken an RV safety course. I looked around at several of the on-line quote companies and most of them asked about an RV safety course or commercial license.

My 92 year old grandma could go down to the RV showroom with her car license and pull out in a 40 foot airbrake operated coach without any problems. A 16 year old with a new license could do the same. See the problem?

Won't happen, but should be considered...
Anyone who now drives an RV should be Grandfathered in and any new owners should be made to get a special license. The RV industry should be given guidlines that tell them overloading should not be tolerated and give them a percentage for that based upon sleeping size. [/B]

quote:

Originally posted by davebowers:
Bill, double dittos to you.

I recall the National Dolphins being overloaded by a grand or two before the driver climbed into the drivers seat. This is why I get jittery when I see gas coaches with Corian, tile bath and kitchen floors.

The last thing I would worry about is a broken tranny or worn out engine when you compare the braking requirements for a P-30 chassis overweight from the start and then pulling an F-150. Now if you have a 37,000# Gillig chassis with 6K to use for stuff that's one thing, But, I know that my 13,500 lb Regal weights 14K with out my svelte 280# and the little Saturn we pull. I leave miles between me and the guy in front.

I was at our local garden place which sells stepping stones, gravel, volcanic rock for landscape etc. I saw a guy in an S-10 have a Bobcat fill that baby up with class 5 limestone until the springs were touching. I heard the dope say, ya I only have a couple miles to do I'll make it. I knew that for him to go anywhere he would have to go through 2 stop signs and a light. I bet you ten bucks he drove through the first sign and maybe stopped for the second.

If you are going to have a severely overweight coach that is your biz, but make sure you have good brakes, and if you are pulling something you have a Brake-buddy or other braking assist devise.

quote:

Originally posted by Rusty:
I agree with the licensing requirement - and with the near-criminal corner-cutting by the manufacturers. A friend of mine got a new Tradewinds LTC (no exactly an economy coach) and off the showroom floor it had 450 lbs. of capacity left. After a bit of cajoling, Tradewinds agreed to replace the wheels and tires.

quote:

Originally posted by humbojb:
Yeah, but isn't the axle rating the axle rating? I always thought the ratings were based on the axle, not the wheels or the tires?

quote:

Originally posted by Rusty:
Some are axles, some are tires - from what I can tell, the axles on my 28' Breakaway (16K GVW 6K front, 10K rear) are the same as the 30' Breakaway (18K GVW). With the LR F tires, the tires can handle 12K in the rear and 7K in the front.

I doubt the same overbuild would exist in all the chasses.

Anyway, owners of SOBs seem to have far more problems with undersized tires than with axle bearings or springs.