Forums    General Discussions    1997 Engine Blew!
Page 1 2 
Go to...
Start A New Topic
Search
Notify
Tools
Reply To This Topic
  
1997 Engine Blew!
 Login now/Join our community
 
posted
I could use some advice. I own a 31' Barth with the Chevy Vortex and it just blew at 55K miles. Cost to replace is $12K can anyone tell me if they think this fair price? I bought it new in 1997. Any suggestions...paulestridge@estridge.net
 
Posts: 1 | Location: Carmel, IN, USA | Member Since: 04-03-2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
First Month Member
Supporting Member of Barthmobile.com 11/13
posted Hide Post
Is that for a factory crate engine, or what?


.

84 30T PeeThirty-Something, 502 powered
 
Posts: 6169 | Location: AZ Central Highlands | Member Since: 01-09-2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
FKA: noble97monarch
Supporting Member of Barthmobile.com 3/12
Picture of Moonbeam-Express
posted Hide Post
It sounds very, very high to me. You can generally buy truck crate motors for $4 to $5K. There is just no way to justify $7K more to change them out. I'll bet shopping around you can get the job done for $8 or less. Try your local Chevy dealer too.

Before you spend all this money you may want to investigate why you are chewing up motors. Cooling, overstress, driving habits, maintenance are all suspects.

If the 350 is too small, should you consider a larger gas motor, if cooling should you invest in a better radiator and so on.

Make sure you buy a truck motor, not a car version. In a 350 Chevy the truck motors will have a beefy 4 bolt main crankshaft and different heads and cam for better torque.


Questions you need to help us on java

Is it possible the previous engine swap used a car motor? How many miles did you get on the original? How well maintained, any overheating? Did old parts get used in the first swap? What was the reason this second engine failed, and the first (meaning what parts failed)?

One final suggestion; vehicles that get used infrequently still need the oil changed at regular intervals despite the few miles. A major reason for this is that the oil becomes contaminated in an internal combustion engine when it is run. Dangerous acids and moisture will get in where they can eat you engine up despite it just sitting there.

Hope this helps,

Corey




Formerly: 1997 Barth Monarch
Now: 2000 BlueBird Wanderlodge 43' LXi Millennium Edition DD Series 60 500HP 3 stage Jake, Overbuilt bike lift with R1200GS BMW, followed by 2011 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited,
“I haven’t been everywhere, but it’s on my list.”
 
Posts: 2228 | Location: Laurel Park, NC | Member Since: 03-16-2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
FKA: noble97monarch
Supporting Member of Barthmobile.com 3/12
Picture of Moonbeam-Express
posted Hide Post
Just by coincidence, I just saw this ad in the Tampa Bay Craigslist under boats. A 350 4 bolt main motor for $600

sale-2rxxh-1498581330@craigslist.org




Formerly: 1997 Barth Monarch
Now: 2000 BlueBird Wanderlodge 43' LXi Millennium Edition DD Series 60 500HP 3 stage Jake, Overbuilt bike lift with R1200GS BMW, followed by 2011 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited,
“I haven’t been everywhere, but it’s on my list.”
 
Posts: 2228 | Location: Laurel Park, NC | Member Since: 03-16-2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Supporting Member of Barthmobile.com 6/12
Formally known as "Humbojb"
Picture of Jim and Tere
posted Hide Post
Not being much of a mechanic, this may be a dumb statement. I guess the original engine was a 454. Except for very short models, Barth didn't use 350s, so, who advised you to put a 350 in there to begin with? I would think it is underpowered for the 31' Barth. Also, what is the original year and model of your Barth and the GVWR?
Jim


Jim and TereJim and Tere

1985 Regal
29' Chevy 454 P32
8411 3172 29FP3B
Gear Vendor 6 Speed Tranny
 
Posts: 3696 | Location: madisonville tn usa | Member Since: 02-19-2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Supporting Member of Barthmobile.com 3/11
Picture of Tom  and Julie
posted Hide Post
If I were doing this I would use a GM HT 502 (http://www.crateenginedepot.com/store/HT-502CI-Base-Truck-and-Off-Road-Crate-Engine-88890534-P14C0.aspx) and add fuel injection form Edelbrock, serpentine drive, and MSD electronic ignition. That whole setup, including labor should still be less than 12K!


1993 32' Regency Wide Body, 4 speed Allison Trans, Front Entry door, Diamond Plate aluminum roof &
1981 Euro 22' w Chevy 350 engine and TH 400 tranny
 
Posts: 1513 | Location: Houston Texas | Member Since: 12-19-2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
FKA: noble97monarch
Supporting Member of Barthmobile.com 3/12
Picture of Moonbeam-Express
posted Hide Post
quote:
Picture of Tom K

Posted 12-07-2009 10:03 AM Hide Post
If I were doing this I would use a GM HT 502


I agree with Tom if you plan to keep the rig very long term. Going to a Big Block has many complications with brackets and mounts. I would not take this leap lightly. Otherwise, I would find a decent used engine and take the risk that it is a good one. The swap should be a $1000 adventure.

Corey




Formerly: 1997 Barth Monarch
Now: 2000 BlueBird Wanderlodge 43' LXi Millennium Edition DD Series 60 500HP 3 stage Jake, Overbuilt bike lift with R1200GS BMW, followed by 2011 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited,
“I haven’t been everywhere, but it’s on my list.”
 
Posts: 2228 | Location: Laurel Park, NC | Member Since: 03-16-2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
"Host" of Barthmobile.com
Supporting Member of Barthmobile.com 1/19
Picture of Bill N.Y.
posted Hide Post
I'll tell you some of the backstory on this.

The gentleman who owns this had it towed to the Chevy Dealership for pricing. The engine went boom when his employee was driving it back from vacation. He loaned his coach out so who knows how it was driven and what the true reason behind the failure was.

He has owned it since new... he is trying to justify investing another 12k into his coach. It is currently in Erie, PA and he lives in Carmel, Indiana. A 420 mile tow bill.


˙ʎ˙u ןןıq- „ǝןƃuɐ ʇuǝɹǝɟɟıp ɐ ɯoɹɟ pןɹoʍ ǝɥʇ ʇɐ ʞooן ɐ ƃuıʞɐʇ sı ǝɟıן oʇ ʇǝɹɔǝs ǝɥʇ„

Regis Widebody1990 Barth Regis Widebody
8908 0128 40RDS-C1
L-10 Cummins
Allison MT647 Transmission
Spartan Chassis
Regal Conversion1991 Medical Lab Conversion
9102 3709 33S-12
Ford 460 MPFI
C6 Transmission
Oshkosh Chassis



Quick Link: Members Only Link To Send Me A Private Message
 
Posts: 5924 | Location: Newburgh, New York | Member Since: 05-10-2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Supporting Member of Barthmobile.com 12/12
Picture of Lee
posted Hide Post
Barth was building gassers in 1997? hmm
 
Posts: 1266 | Location: Frederick, Maryland | Member Since: 09-12-2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Supporting Member of Barthmobile.com 6/12
Formally known as "Humbojb"
Picture of Jim and Tere
posted Hide Post
Again, is the coach a '97 or was the Chevy Vortex a '97 or both? Maybe this old brain isn't working right Red Face


Jim and TereJim and Tere

1985 Regal
29' Chevy 454 P32
8411 3172 29FP3B
Gear Vendor 6 Speed Tranny
 
Posts: 3696 | Location: madisonville tn usa | Member Since: 02-19-2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
First Month Member
Supporting Member of Barthmobile.com 11/13
posted Hide Post
Perhaps there is a little confusion here. I suspect the original engine is an L29 Vortec 7400, which is a 454.

quote:
Originally posted by Tom K:
If I were doing this I would use a GM HT 502 (http://www.crateenginedepot.com/store/HT-502CI-Base-Truck-and-Off-Road-Crate-Engine-88890534-P14C0.aspx) and add fuel injection form Edelbrock, serpentine drive, and MSD electronic ignition. That whole setup, including labor should still be less than 12K!


I'm not sure how the Edelbrock FI would interact with the computer control of the transmission, or the emissions police. The trans might need a stand-alone controller.

I love my 502, but the 502 isn't really necessary except uphill, so some of that depends on where you drive and what you tow. I really love the low and midrange RPM torque of the 502. Unlike the Vortec, it gets its peak torque at 2800 rpm, and has a table-top flat torque line on the dyno graph. Notice that I did NOT use the term torque curve.

The 502 is a Siamese block, so it needs help in cooling. So does the transmission, as the 502 puts a lot of stress on the torque converter (at least when unlocked).

It is possible that the engine can be saved. If it ate a crank from low oil, now would be a good time to put in a stroker crank.


.

84 30T PeeThirty-Something, 502 powered
 
Posts: 6169 | Location: AZ Central Highlands | Member Since: 01-09-2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Supporting Member of Barthmobile.com 6/12
Formally known as "Humbojb"
Picture of Jim and Tere
posted Hide Post
Thanks for straightening me out, Bill. Thumbs Up
Jim


Jim and TereJim and Tere

1985 Regal
29' Chevy 454 P32
8411 3172 29FP3B
Gear Vendor 6 Speed Tranny
 
Posts: 3696 | Location: madisonville tn usa | Member Since: 02-19-2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
First Month Member
Supporting Member of Barthmobile.com 11/13
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Jim and Tere:
Thanks for straightening me out, Bill. Thumbs Up
Jim


Yeah, it's easy to get the terms mixed. GM played it fast and loose with the Vortec and Vortex designation. I think they even confused themselves now and then.


.

84 30T PeeThirty-Something, 502 powered
 
Posts: 6169 | Location: AZ Central Highlands | Member Since: 01-09-2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
"Host" of Barthmobile.com
Supporting Member of Barthmobile.com 1/19
Picture of Bill N.Y.
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by bill h:
Yeah, it's easy to get the terms mixed. GM played it fast and loose... I think they even confused themselves now and then.
P32 or P30??? Big Grin


˙ʎ˙u ןןıq- „ǝןƃuɐ ʇuǝɹǝɟɟıp ɐ ɯoɹɟ pןɹoʍ ǝɥʇ ʇɐ ʞooן ɐ ƃuıʞɐʇ sı ǝɟıן oʇ ʇǝɹɔǝs ǝɥʇ„

Regis Widebody1990 Barth Regis Widebody
8908 0128 40RDS-C1
L-10 Cummins
Allison MT647 Transmission
Spartan Chassis
Regal Conversion1991 Medical Lab Conversion
9102 3709 33S-12
Ford 460 MPFI
C6 Transmission
Oshkosh Chassis



Quick Link: Members Only Link To Send Me A Private Message
 
Posts: 5924 | Location: Newburgh, New York | Member Since: 05-10-2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Supporting Member of Barthmobile.com 8/12
posted Hide Post
A friend of mine had to replace a 454 in his Airstream while on a trip. Total cost of rebuilt engine and installation $7600.00. If he had it home and could have talked to his mechanic, he could probably have shaved of $1000.00 to $1500.00.
 
Posts: 15 | Location: New Philadelphia, Ohio 44663 | Member Since: 10-07-2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
  Powered by Social Strata Page 1 2  
 

    Forums    General Discussions    1997 Engine Blew!

This website is dedicated to the Barth Custom Coach, their owners and those who admire this American made, quality crafted, motor coach.
We are committed to the history, preservation and restoration of the Barth Custom Coach.