I am considering removing a window and reskinning that upper side. Can anyone tell me what grade and thickness of smooth aluminum is used in this area on the Barth and where I could get it? Also I need to know about the rivets.
Thank You

quote:

Originally posted by Lovestogo:
Can anyone tell me what grade and thickness of smooth aluminum is used in this area on the Barth and where I could get it? Also I need to know about the rivets.

I know it's been 10 days since you asked, and for the life of me I don't remember seeing this when you first posted it... But, if you don't have an answer yet, I would check with dustyjeeper, he has re-skinned several sections of his Barth.

I bought a 4x8 sheet of smooth aluminum for $100 and a sheet of 4x8 aluminum diamond plate for $110. They are a little thicker than whats on the barth but it was at my local welding supply house. I'm also just using aluminum pop rivets from ace hardware. The rivets in the structure I won't fill. The rivets in the roof will be sealed with my rubber roof. The rivets on the outer side walls will be filled with alumafill. (It's an autobody filler.)

quote:

Originally posted by Lovestogo:
I am considering removing a window and reskinning that upper side. Can anyone tell me what grade and thickness of smooth aluminum is used in this area on the Barth and where I could get it?

Perhaps one of the members here who has their inside walls removed can take a peek. Sheet aluminum is usually marked in a bluish-purple ink. An example would be 2024-T3 followed by the thickness in inches. Expressed as, for example, .040

If I were to replace any skin, I would use 2024-T3 or a 6061. Both are good skin material. I would want it clad on at least the outside surface, for corrosion resistance. 2024, being a copper-bearing alloy is not too corrosion-prone if properly treated, but I would avoid 6061 if unclad. If someone tries to sell you 7075, RUN!

I lifted the following from an ad long ago. It appears to have been lifted from a Barth publication.

"Sidewall, end and roof sections .062 aluminum extrusion framework, interlocked and hand buck riveted into unitized body framework.

Sidewall, roof and end panels joined with .080 aluminum extruded 'Z' bar per Barth Patent 3,282,603.

Sidewalls and end panels incorporate .040 aluminum
skin riveted to unitized aluminum frame.

Roof and sub-chassis underbelly incorporate .030
aluminum skin."

---

When I gutted my bedroom, I had some metal exposed, there was not enough exposed to read any numbers, but I measured the skin. I think it was .040, what the ad said. My memory is a little foggy there, but I believe I would have made a notation or thrown a tantrum or something if it were different.

quote:

Originally posted by Lovestogo:
Also I need to know about the rivets.
Thank You

Whenever possible, I would also do as Barth did, and use AN470AD aircraft rivets, hand-bucked. They have two compelling advantages:

1. They expand as they are bucked down to fill any oversize or mismatch in the holes. This not only makes it stronger, but it removes any pockets for corrosion to form.

2. They temper (or work-harden) themselves as they are bucked down, making them much stronger than when they started out.

I an no longer current on FAA regs, but only a few of the blind rivets were approved for structural use. They are expensive, selection is critical, hole size is critical, and they require an expensive and powerful tool to pull them properly. Cherrylocks, for example.

Having said all that, a Barth is sort of semi-monocoque construction, so the structural strictures might not apply. I am sure some bus conversion sites would have good information on rivets.

There was a homebuilt in the early '60s, the Thorp T18, that used hardware store pop rivets. John Thorp was a sharp engineer, and he was right about the soft pop rivets being adequate, if you used enough of them as well as his "matched hole" technique. However, he did not use Chinese rivets.

I believe some of the RV series of aircraft also use pop rivets.

Thanks very much folks. Exactly the kind of information and detail I had hoped for.

The Airstream forum group has a lot of information on restoration work on the Airstreams, a lot of information they have I would think would apply to our Barths. They do have a exterior restoration forum that has a lot of information on rivets and skin replacement. If you Google Airstream Forums you should find it. When you get to the Airstream Forum Home page click on forum interface and the different forums will come up. A lot of good information there. We are restoring a 1957 13 panel Airstream and the site has been a great help.
Rick