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Transmission upgrade
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Supporting Member of Barthmobile.com 4/08
posted
I have made the plunge and the 542 transmission in our beakaway is soon to be history. I found an Allison 2000 on ebay and it gets delivered monday (Dec 3). This particular transmission was behind a 466 binder engine with a SAE3 bell housing and has the driveshaft brake. This is a 2001 model year so it is a 5 speed with lockup convertor. The overdrive ratio is .71:1 so my engine RPMs sould drop from 2400 at 65 MPH to 1800 at 65MPH. Have also ordered the throttle position sensor as this is required with a mechanical engine. The 2000 is also just about the same length as the 542 and about the same weight so the install should almost be a bolt out and then bolt in. Also the 2000 uses a cable to shift so with some luck the stock shifter may just work.

I know there is a great deal of interest in this project so I plan on keeping a running commentary on this. Just keep in mind I do work slow, but hope to have it running by the middle of Jan. at the latest, but I could get it done by the middle of this month. If anyone in the Yuma AZ area want to check it out you are welcome.


'92 Barth Breakaway - 30'
5.9 Cummins (6B) 300+ HP
2000 Allison
Front entrance
 
Posts: 923 | Location: Minneapolis/Yuma | Member Since: 08-17-2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Supporting Member of Barthmobile.com 8/16
Picture of Bill N.Y.
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quote:
Originally posted by Gary Carter:
I know there is a great deal of interest in this project so I plan on keeping a running commentary on this.
I can't wait. Looking forward to seeing and hearing about your upgrade.

So, it was originally attached to a 2001 DT466 International? Would you happen to know what the first gear ratio of the 2000 Allison Transmission is or what the rear end ratio and tires size was on the "Corn Binder"? If you don't know, ask the seller the last 8 of the vin number and I'll get you that info.


˙ʎ˙u ןןıq- „ǝןƃuɐ ʇuǝɹǝɟɟıp ɐ ɯoɹɟ pןɹoʍ ǝɥʇ ʇɐ ʞooן ɐ ƃuıʞɐʇ sı ǝɟıן oʇ ʇǝɹɔǝs ǝɥʇ„

Regis Widebody1990 Barth Regis Widebody
8908 0128 40RDS-C1
L-10 Cummins
Allison MT647 Transmission
Spartan Chassis
Regal Conversion1991 Medical Lab Conversion
9102 3709 33S-12
Ford 460 MPFI
C6 Transmission
Oshkosh Chassis



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Posts: 7289 | Location: Newburgh, New York | Member Since: 05-10-2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Supporting Member of Barthmobile.com 10/08
Picture of MWrench
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quote:
2000 Allison Transmission

Great project! You are going to like the lower RPM at cruise.

The Allison 2000 weighs 200 lbs less then the MD3060 and has better ground clearance because the case is smaller.

Gear ratio spread of the 2000 is very close to the MD3060 1st to 5th, 3.51:1 first vs. 3.49 , 0.74:1 5th vs. 0.75:1 6th on MD3060 is 0.65:1.

I have been trying to get down to the Yuma area but so far way to busy to break loose, would like to see the project in progress!


Ed
94 30' Breakaway #3864
30-BS-6B side entry
230 Cummins, Allison 6 speed
Spartan chassis
K9DVC
 
Posts: 1893 | Location: Los Gatos, CA | Member Since: 12-08-2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Supporting Member of Barthmobile.com 4/08
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Had a good piece of news today. The flex plate for the 542 will work on the Allison 2000. A few hundred saved.


'92 Barth Breakaway - 30'
5.9 Cummins (6B) 300+ HP
2000 Allison
Front entrance
 
Posts: 923 | Location: Minneapolis/Yuma | Member Since: 08-17-2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Supporting Member of Barthmobile.com 10/08
Picture of MWrench
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Any news? How is it going? I was trying to get to the Barth Ranger Rally at Quartzite later this month and come down to see you but I think you will be out during that time.

Anxious to hear how it is going!!


Ed
94 30' Breakaway #3864
30-BS-6B side entry
230 Cummins, Allison 6 speed
Spartan chassis
K9DVC
 
Posts: 1893 | Location: Los Gatos, CA | Member Since: 12-08-2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Supporting Member of Barthmobile.com 4/08
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Still gathering all the pieces before I start. With any luck that will be next week. The last piece of good new is that the yoke on the 542 should fit the 2000. Looks like it is going to be a R&R job. Even appears the cable shifter from the 542 will work for the 2000.

I found golden source of knowledge on the east coast. They are reprogramming a TCM for me and providing all the wiring cables and ends.

The TCM (transmission control module) has two connection on it. One is from the transmission and the other is for the vehicle. Things like power, speedometer, 12vdc, switched 12vdc, plus other and the diagnostic conector.

So once all the wiring is accounted for it then means drain the oil, drop the 542 and bolt on the 2000. Sounds almost to simple to be true.


'92 Barth Breakaway - 30'
5.9 Cummins (6B) 300+ HP
2000 Allison
Front entrance
 
Posts: 923 | Location: Minneapolis/Yuma | Member Since: 08-17-2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Picture of Gunner
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"I found golden source of knowledge on the east coast. They are reprogramming a TCM for me and providing all the wiring cables and ends."

Are you comfortable supplying a name? Other Barthers may appreciate a tip.


"You are what you drive" - Clint Eastwood
 
Posts: 573 | Location: Republic of Texas | Member Since: 12-31-2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Supporting Member of Barthmobile.com 4/08
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Ok, the Allison source is Ted Keating. He has a web site www.tktsales.com. Don't know if I am suppose to list it or not, but Ted gave his ok.

He worked for allison for something like 13 years and now just sells allison parts. He seems to know what fits what. Plus what program I need in the TCM.


'92 Barth Breakaway - 30'
5.9 Cummins (6B) 300+ HP
2000 Allison
Front entrance
 
Posts: 923 | Location: Minneapolis/Yuma | Member Since: 08-17-2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Supporting Member of Barthmobile.com 11/12
Picture of Nick Cagle
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Ugly Betty, Aka a 93 Regency, 300 CAT has a perfectly good Allison 4 speed transmission. I have wondered about an upgrade to the Allsion 6 Speed. Has anyone ever done it? Would fuel economy and engine wear improve enough with the overdrives to justify it? Ugly Betty gets about 8 to 9 mpg now.
Nick
 
Posts: 1802 | Location: Harlem, GA | Member Since: 09-17-2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Supporting Member of Barthmobile.com 10/08
Picture of MWrench
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You have 70 HP on me, I have a 30' with the 230 Cummins and 6 speed. I have averaged for the past 30K miles 10.6 MPG ( have all receipts!) I know I could do better if I just would slow down, I regularly drive the freeway speed limits but never exceed 75 MPH.

I am making some intake mods later this spring that I hope will increase the torque in the 1500-2000 RPM band and hope that will also increase the mileage.

I know if I didn't have the 6 speed it would be far worse, I would be on the governor constantly. I can't speak for what the Cat would do, but it is a proven fact if RPMs are reduced (not to low) it will increase mileage.

I try to gear diesels so that cruise RPM is slightly above peak torque RPM.

What is your cruise MPH/RPM?


Ed
94 30' Breakaway #3864
30-BS-6B side entry
230 Cummins, Allison 6 speed
Spartan chassis
K9DVC
 
Posts: 1893 | Location: Los Gatos, CA | Member Since: 12-08-2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Supporting Member of Barthmobile.com 11/12
Picture of Nick Cagle
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quote:
Originally posted by MWrench:

What is your cruise MPH/RPM?


I also have a heavy foot and will drive the coach at 70 to 75 on the interstates.
I have always been a pretty smooth driver and can usually get 1 to 2 more mpg out of a vehicle than someone else driving the same unit. Of course this is primarily with autos and pickups. The coach runs about 2400 rpm at 70.
Nick
 
Posts: 1802 | Location: Harlem, GA | Member Since: 09-17-2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Supporting Member of Barthmobile.com 10/08
Picture of MWrench
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I run about 1920 at 70. The 6 speed is a double overdrive and 5th is 0.75:1 and 6th is a deep overdrive at 0.65:1

I have a 4.1:1 diff but 19.5 tires and that make a huge difference. I know of another breakaway I believe is 32 foot and he has 22.5 tires, same trans/diff I have and he doesn't get into 6th at all below 75.


Ed
94 30' Breakaway #3864
30-BS-6B side entry
230 Cummins, Allison 6 speed
Spartan chassis
K9DVC
 
Posts: 1893 | Location: Los Gatos, CA | Member Since: 12-08-2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Supporting Member of Barthmobile.com 2/16
Captain Doom
Picture of Rusty
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quote:
Originally posted by Nick Cagle:
The coach runs about 2400 rpm at 70.
Nick


IIRC, (It's been many, many years) the 3280 should run at around 1,800 RPM. The sweet spot is a few (50-100 RPM above the peak of the torque curve). I run my AMG 6.5L TD at 2,600 RPM typically, for that reason, but it's a short-stroke engine.


Rusty


MilSpec AMG 6.5L TD 230HP; built-to-order by Peninsular Engines:  Hi-pop injectors, gear-driven camshaft, non-waste-gated, high-output turbo, 18:1 pistons.  Fuel economy increased by 15-20%, power, WOW!"StaRV II"

'94 28' Breakaway: MilSpec AMG 6.5L TD 230HP

Nelson and Chester, not-spoiled Golden Retrievers

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In either case the idea is quite staggering.
- Arthur C. Clarke

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Posts: 8200 | Location: Brooker, FL, USA | Member Since: 09-08-2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Supporting Member of Barthmobile.com 10/09
Picture of towerguy
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Rusty:
quote:
Originally posted by Nick Cagle:
The coach runs about 2400 rpm at 70.
Nick


IIRC, (It's been many, many years) the 3280 should run at around 1,800 RPM. The sweet spot is a few (50-100 RPM above the peak of the torque curve). I run my AMG 6.5L TD at 2,600 RPM typically, for that reason, but it's a short-stroke engine.


My Stagecoach runs about the same as Nick's. What needs to be adjusted in order for it to be running where it should?


Bill, Sharron, Hayley and Bridgett


1990 38' Regency Widebody [RDG-B), Anniversary Edition, Cat 3208TA - 300HP, Gillig Chassis, Side Aisle

"Stagecoach"
1990 38' Regency Widebody (RDG-B)
Anniversary Edition
Cat 3208TA - 300HP
Gillig Chassis
Side Aisle

 
Posts: 620 | Location: Colorado Springs, CO | Member Since: 04-02-2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Supporting Member of Barthmobile.com 10/08
Picture of MWrench
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Can't adjust, the RPM/MPH is set by the gearing of the trans and diff and tire size. Nothing really to worry about.


Ed
94 30' Breakaway #3864
30-BS-6B side entry
230 Cummins, Allison 6 speed
Spartan chassis
K9DVC
 
Posts: 1893 | Location: Los Gatos, CA | Member Since: 12-08-2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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